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   Information requested for SPMS patient re: Rebif vs. Betaseron vs. Methotrexate (Multiple Sclerosis board)

13th March 2008
Dave, first of all welcome...we are glad that you came to us for information; however it appears that you have your info confused..either that or their is confusion in terms being used.

Let me give you some infromation and you can take this back and verify what you said vs what Im telling you.

MS does NOT always progress...the first and most common stage, which over 90% of people have, and this is what you are describing your wife to have, is relapsing remitting MS. Sounds exactly like what your wife has been dealing with all these years...the key to this is that the disease can actually not have any real symtoms or very minimal symtoms- for very long stretches of time...then, all the sudden something happens. This something, is known as a relapse or excaberation. It is defined by a set of new or reoccuring symptoms which last longer than 24 hours and do not go away on their own.

Now,it is possible that your wife could have had primary progrssive MS; however it doesnt fit....this form of MS is much more progresssive and she would have had many issues throughout the last few years which would have really been obvious. Im sticking with R/R as what she was originally diagnosed with.

That being said, she doesnt necessarily have SPMS now. And, she probably doesnt.....however, if she does, doctors probably wouldnt be talking about the disease modifying drugs. THey arent approved for SPMS. ITs possible that a very small percentage of docs would try to us a DMD in order to slow down progression, but again, they arent suposed to work for SPMS.

My guess is that your wife is finally getting more active in her MS in general and her R/R has started "up" again....this being said, using DMDs (avonex, betaseron, Rebif, copaxone) would make perfect sense...too bad she hasnt been on them already, it might have prevented this- but that is a very personal choice.

Now, Dave, I could be wrong here. I know of one person with SPMS who is taking Rebif, and truthfully we cant tell if it is helping her or not. She is constnatly having issues, but she has other health issues which complicate the MS as well....but her doc has her taking Rebif simply because in his opinion "it cant hurt". It really cant....but will it help?

Methotrexate is not approved for MS ; however it is being used in small doses for other autoimmune diseases...I personally wouldnt want that in my body as it is closely related to Chemo.
I take Rebif, and Rebif and Betaseron are both interferons. Interferons are made up naturally in the body- the shots are completely different. I happen to love Rebif and can tell you all about it, while never haveing been on Beta.
Both rebif and beta have some pretty harsh side effects the first 3 months you take them, flu like symtoms which are horrible..but those symtoms can be managed with an over the counter NSAId - here alot of us take Aleve pre shot because it seems to work best.

What makes me question your post the most is that if your wife hasnt gotten any new lesions- then something is not right about this explanation.....progression IS DEFINED by new lesions. I believe that your wife is having a relapse- and thats normal- and that at this time, the docs are trying to convince her to start meds to prevent more relapses, more lesions and/or more symtoms...but progression isnt possible without new lesions, shes done very well for a long time without progression so moving it to SPMS doesnt fit.
Are you guys seeing an MS Specialist or a regular Neuro? It might be time for a second opinion and evaluation....before anyone tells you that she needs to be on meds or suggests Methotrexate or tells you that she is progrssing, I would want another opnion.

Whatever we can do for you, shout out. Were here.
14th March 2008
Hi Dave. First of all, Ill apologize if any of the "info" I gave you sounded misconstred..I also did some verifying of information today and found that alot of what you said was absolutely correct, and some of what I said - not. I apologize. I was basing my answers on answers I have been given, but not having progressed in the past 2 years, my info wasnt updated.

Anyway, I have to concur about the heat thing...if someone put heat on my body, Id be in the hosptial immeidately with a relapse- and you would have to pick me up off the ground. Heat, to me - is the enemy....I cant take hot baths or showers anymore...however, I can be outside in the heat, as long as I am constantly in touch with water...water on my feet (a pool or ocean) water on my wrists and the back of my neck- a cooling hat or vest- and I can handle it..I just cant sit in it or apply it in the form of a heating pad.

I am really glad to hear that your wife is seeing an MS specialist...there is no better way to get updated, accurate info; and many regular Neuros do not keep up on whats the latest....if you are comfortable with her level of care, then Im sure its fine - you sound very intelligent and concerned. Im sure nothing gets by you!

All I can tell you about is Rebif- although Rebif and Beta are not much different, one is an interferon A, the other an interferon B....Avonex and Rebif are the identical drug- avonex came out first, many patients complained that the once a week injection left them feeling like they "needed their meds" by mid week, so Rebif was developed as a 3 time a week shot, which is subcutaneous as opposed to intramuscular- in order to keep blood levels or med levels in the blood more consistent...seems to be working because there are more people on Rebif now then any other DMD...I really like it and its worked for me- as I stated before I havent had any progression or new lesions since starting it....Betaseron is taken every other day, thus it is 3 times a week some weeks, and 4 times a week others- not much different overall, the flu like side effects are virtually the same, and it has been on the market longer than Avonex or Rebif- but just the same I prefer the Rebif, the needle is smaller- for one thing- the shot, to me, is easier to manage.....but others who are doing well on Beta, might swear they would never change. I dont know...

I do wish you and your wife the very best of everything...its nice to see a concerned spouse here. I am married with a husband that thinks if you ignore it, it will go away. I still work 40+ hours a week in sales- manage a household, take care of 3 kids (1 is adopted, the other two are his from previous marriage) and an obviously needy husband...life goes on with MS.....but its never easy...

Please shout out more questions, and ask specifically about Betaseron...we do have a few users of that drug here..
Nikki
14th March 2008
Hi Dave

I am not taking any of those drugs. I was diagnosed last March and have had four relapses since then. My right side is my problem mainly my right foot it has never gone back to normal and I still don't have feelings in that foot. I understand the walking problem as I can barely walk three blocks without having tingling and heavy foot, I need something or someone to hold onto. I am in a study group so I don't know what meds I'm on, it is either copaxone or avonex or a combination of the two. I love the program because I get extra attention and I never have to wait for an appointment, I have an mri twice a year and it is all paid for by the study program. I have one large lesion on my brain stem and I just found out that I developed a new small lesion on the top right side of the brain. The good news is that the large lesion is starting to resolve itself. I have started doing yoga specifically designed for ms patients with limitations or in a wheelchair maybe that will help your wife. See if your wife might qualify for a study program as they watch you like a hawk and they really listen to every thing you say without acting like you arebothering them. I think its because you might be on a new drug and they want to make sure your not having new symptoms GOOD LUCK!!!! hotflash:wave:
14th March 2008
Dave,
My MS path sounds very similar to your wife's. I was diagnosed in 1990. Very few problems. In the past 10 years the same minor symptoms I had were getting worse, although the MRI's showed no active lessions. I was on Avonex then switched to Rebif when I started declining. Both have not been tested on SPMS, so after a few years I decided not to take Rebif. At my next appointment I am going to discuss Betaseran with my doctor. Good luck to you & your wife.
15th March 2008
[QUOTE=hotflash;3485954]Hi Dave

I am not taking any of those drugs. I was diagnosed last March and have had four relapses since then. My right side is my problem mainly my right foot it has never gone back to normal and I still don't have feelings in that foot. I understand the walking problem as I can barely walk three blocks without having tingling and heavy foot, I need something or someone to hold onto. I am in a study group so I don't know what meds I'm on, it is either copaxone or avonex or a combination of the two. I love the program because I get extra attention and I never have to wait for an appointment, I have an mri twice a year and it is all paid for by the study program. I have one large lesion on my brain stem and I just found out that I developed a new small lesion on the top right side of the brain. The good news is that the large lesion is starting to resolve itself. I have started doing yoga specifically designed for ms patients with limitations or in a wheelchair maybe that will help your wife. See if your wife might qualify for a study program as they watch you like a hawk and they really listen to every thing you say without acting like you arebothering them. I think its because you might be on a new drug and they want to make sure your not having new symptoms GOOD LUCK!!!! hotflash:wave:
16th March 2008
[QUOTE=LUV2DANCE2;3486925]Dave,
My MS path sounds very similar to your wife's. I was diagnosed in 1990. Very few problems. In the past 10 years the same minor symptoms I had were getting worse, although the MRI's showed no active lessions. I was on Avonex then switched to Rebif when I started declining. Both have not been tested on SPMS, so after a few years I decided not to take Rebif. At my next appointment I am going to discuss Betaseran with my doctor. Good luck to you & your wife.
16th March 2008
[QUOTE=LUV2DANCE2;3486925]Dave,
My MS path sounds very similar to your wife's. I was diagnosed in 1990. Very few problems. In the past 10 years the same minor symptoms I had were getting worse, although the MRI's showed no active lessions. I was on Avonex then switched to Rebif when I started declining. Both have not been tested on SPMS, so after a few years I decided not to take Rebif. At my next appointment I am going to discuss Betaseran with my doctor. Good luck to you & your wife.

Hi Luv2dDance2 ... I obviously haven't mastered the Reply protocol yet! :>)

Thanks very much for your response to my post. I went back and read your own post of a couple of months ago. Your situation does indeed sound similar to that of my wife. She has been doing quite a bit of research on her own and she is now leaning towards a startup on Betaseron. I don't know when your next appointment is, but suspect that my wife may have already started this treatment by then. If there is anything that she learns or experiences re: this treatment that I think might be of benefit to you I'll pass it along.

It sounds like they started you on Avonex right away after your being diagnosed? Is that true? If so, how long were you on it and did you have any adverse side-effects or experiences besides the obvious failure of the drug to retard the progress of your condition? Also, it isn't quite clear to me if you stopped the Rebif because it was not retarding your progression any more than the Avonex, or just that you were unsure of its effectiveness for treating SPMS because of a lack of clinical evidence of such. If you care to clarify this for me I would really appreciate it!

Again, thanks very much for having taken the time and effort to repond to my post!!!!

- Dave
 
 

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